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I think the fact that main core Sōshū works lack signed & dated work. from Yukimitsu, Masamune & Sadamune there are extremely few dated items and it makes researching quite difficult. Then For Hiromitsu, Akihiro and onwards you will find lots of signed & dated swords. I feel when making statements like in the link that "there are dated works by Gō Yoshihiro before studying with Masamune" it would be extremely important to give a source of that information or provide a reference item. I have all of these following items featured in my references. Shintōgo Kunimitsu 10 dated works 1294 - 1324 Shintōgo Kunihiro 2 dated works 1318 & 1324 Yukimitsu 1 dated work 1322 Masamune 1 dated work 1328 Sadamune 2 dated works 1335 & 1361 Norishige 6 dated works 1314 - 1328 And for the sake of this discussion 2 Senju'in Yoshihiro smiths that I have data for Yoshihiro (義弘) 2 dated works 1353 & 1358 Yoshihiro (吉広) 1 dated work 1343 One difficult thing when we are discussing lesser known smiths in English, that there can be several Japanese characters that read out same way in English. I checked my sword books for various Senju'in Yoshihiro smiths Yoshihiro (義弘) there are supposedly 2 smiths working c. 1350 , 1400 Yoshihiro (吉広) 1 smith c. 1345 Yoshihiro (吉弘) 1 smith c. 1350 Yoshihiro (義広) 5 smiths working c. 1230 , 1275 , 1335, 1345, 1469 However I believe when NBTHK etc. speak of Senju'in Yoshihiro (義弘) they would refer to c. 1350 working smith. I don't think I have any of the other Senju'in Yoshihiro smiths being referenced anywhere excluding the 1 (1343) dated work from the other smith.

From Venice's Museum of Oriental Art

Yes, it is a real blade indeed and rather striking in real life. Not to everyone’s liking but shows that Yukimitsu could do the Shintogo subtle elegance and then the more flamboyant later hitatsura. I was so surprised by the workmanship that I had to document it…. Plus it is probably the rarest Yukimitsu blade in existence in terms of inscription too. AI translation of the text Short Sword Signed Kamakura [Jū] [Ie] Yukimitsu / Genten Second Year, Third Month (元享二年三月) (March 1322) Blade Length: 23.9 cm Slight curvature inward Late Kamakura Period (Genten 2, 1322) Private Collection In ancient sword manuscripts from the Muromachi period, Yukimitsu is noted for a variety of hamon (blade patterns), including straight lines, small and large waves, and irregular patterns. His work demonstrates diverse techniques. The present blade is mainly straight with shallow irregularities, and larger irregular patterns are not attributed to Yukimitsu’s usual style. This particular sword stands out as a rare example among his works, featuring a thick, layered hamon that mostly shows the notare (wavy) pattern. It also displays kinsuji (bright streaks of hard steel) and nie (crystal-like grains of steel), with yubashiri (a pattern resembling small islands of hard steel) and tobiyaki (areas of the blade hardened by tempering) interwoven, creating a complex and lively appearance. This work is consistent with descriptions in ancient manuscripts, making it an important example when studying Yukimitsu’s legacy. The fact that it is signed and dated further increases its historical value, making it indispensable for research on his school and style.

There's a listing for an interesting shaped naginata with a tempered upper edge...a moroha naginata? Has anyone seen anything like this before? https://www.jauce.com/auction/k1153310910

Gents, I attach the following picture because I have it!! This lovely tsuba was on a mate's Kanesada katana and offers a different perspective of the same theme to Alexander's above. Same school, I wonder?? Bests, BaZZa.

Utsushi - is the word you might need. An "emulation" of a design - not a direct copy but a homage to a design that is well liked. There are thousands of utsushi getting about, but they often get mistaken for the same piece seen in the past - [Who can remember every detail?] I put some Mantis utsushi in my beginners book to compare to cast copies [yes it needs a rewrite] Safe to give the ebay images of your second tsuba as it has already sold https://www.ebay.com/itm/276633048733

Text Pdf available https://archive.org/...anischeText/mode/2up Plates Pdf https://archive.org/...ils/JapanischePlates Reprints from $22 USD https://www.abebooks...neten-9780331743/plp Originals can sell for $171 USD https://www.abebooks...21118&ref_=pd_hw_i_1 The Jacoby along with the Georg Oeder collection were taken by the Russians in 1945 - never to be seen again - unless they are hidden in the "Hermitage" in Saint Petersburg ? [Anyone with a link to get into the Hermitage collections?] I can send a proof copy of the Oeder collection with English translation to anyone who can give me a personal message with a home email address [the file size is too large to send direct through NMB] The Jacoby book was mentioned in the "Connoisseur" in 1904 and included an image of one of the book plates Taf,9. [plate 9]

Back to my original point as to why this blade doesn't have NBTHK papers. I would also focus on the authenticity of the Mei.

Your primary concern is to establish the validity of the Mei. Has it been added later, for example? Can we see the outline of a different, erased Mei underneath? Why is the character 住 (living in) not included? Etc.

Maybe this is interesting: Source -> https://ia804705.us....meitsukushv8oygi.pdf Page number: 29

Great sword, Didier, with plenty of personality! I agree the patina on that sarute matches the kabutogane. Could have been something the owner put on himself. @mecox I do have a June 1942 Masatsugu with star (and Na Ho), posted by @Shuriken. Photos available if needed. I also have another Feb 1942 Masatsugu, with similar painted numbers (A19) and Na Ho. Must have both been fitted from the same shop. That one has an aluminum saya, and no leather.

….and one of the other images …

暦応四年 神力加錬 千手院 源吉廣　Ryaku-o　４、 Shinryoku Karen (Tempered with the power of the gods) Senju-in Minamoto Yoshihiro From here: 美 WA133 鎌倉 南北朝期 暦応四年 神力加錬 千手院 源吉廣 日本刀 ／登録証付 H zy(刀、太刀)｜売買されたオークション情報、yahooの商品情報をアーカイブ公開 - オークファン（aucfan.com）

I do not believe in the UTSUSHI idea in most cases. TSUBA workshops often had standard designs which were copied by the employees over and over again, so it is very likely that close examples appear on the market. Small variations are evident as they did not strive for exact copies.

Alexander, I just noticed the tagane-ato [punch marks around the nakago-ana]. The ones on your example are very, very similar to the old examples I have with the Mantis design. I can't help thinking the same smith used the same tools on all five pieces. I include the three images of the nakago-ana with the punch marks - a series of three dot punches each side, top and bottom. [Ignore the rough outlines of the nakago-ana, that was done manually to give all three images the same background colour] Image is larger and enhanced from the book page example above. Hey Barry is there a Dragonfly on the ura of yours? Nice piece! [that is an understatement!]

Thank you Dale! The perfect example (three mantis tsuba, almost "exact" yet different). Pretty much sums up what's going on for me (although if others have still more to add I welcome the insight). Yes, I purchased it a week and a half ago: while it's an amazing feeling for the two tsuba to be together, I ultimately am gifting #2 to a friend/student. I think it's a fitting gift as they have an interest in Japan, Mantis and have been working on utsushi (a word I just learned) with me as my student. Cheers!

@Yukihiro @Kiipu @Bruce Pennington Didier your blade is dated February 1942 and as noted by Thomas this it pre Star stamp. However, Masatsugu does have one of the earliest Star stamps at August 1942. It would appear that your blade is traditionally made, but whether worth polishing depends on its condition, and the economics. The polish could cost more than the blade value. To further put Masatsugu into context, look at the paper on FUKUOKA in NMB Downloads. This also discusses the nakago mune stamps. Yours is 名ホ. Na/Ho and is an interesting example I did not have, so in Feb 1942 his sword was "collected" by a Nagoya inspector then delivered to Kokura Arsenal where it was polished. See pages 30-32 in the Fukuoka paper. (Note there are several other Masatsugu). From the koshirae it does look that your blade was owned by an officer in the field.

Maybe a standard Shinto naginata with a broken kissaki and reshaped. I believe this is called Satsuma-age when it is done to a sword. Grey

I should have started with Bruce's study on Japanese Sword Stamps:

I don’t know if it was already here, seen on many blades from Fujiyasu Masahira.

Hello, I'm a complete beginner to nihonto, this is the second sword ever I've handled in person. I've got a mumei, out of polish, probably O-suriage katana in rough shape and I've been trying to work out what, approximately, it is, or at least its era. I'm aware that in its present condition not all that much can be deduced for certain, or indeed deduced at all. That said I've been chewing on this blade for the last several days and I would very much appreciate any outside assessments. When I close my eyes I see sugata hovering in the dark. From comparing the sugata to images of other swords, my current guesses are either significantly suriage Muromachi or Kanbun Shinto with an extra hole. It reminds me of a Kanbun Sendai blade in Markus Sesko's kantei series, but that one was ubu, unlike mine. Specifications: Nagasa: 63 cm Nakago: 19 cm Nakagojiri: kiri Yasurime:kiri Sori type: Toriizori, though this is a guess, it was a little hard to tell for certain. Please correct me if I'm wrong. Sori: 1.4 cm Kasane: 0.59 cm Shinogigasane: 0.68 cm Sakigasane: 0.47 cm Motohaba: 3.1 cm Sakihaba: 2.08 cm Mihaba: 1.86 cm Kissaki: 2.96 cm, plus about 2mm of chipped tip Weight: 652 g Hamon: Suguha, Hoso-Suguha perhaps as the yakiba is only about 4mm wide. Little of it is easily visible, but the small part that is seems tight and bright Boshi: Difficult to be certain as the kissaki is severely out of polish, but it looks possibly like Jizoboshi. See oshigata for my interpretation. Ana: two: the lowest is definitely punched, and is smaller than the upper one, which may or may not be drilled. Notes: There's a substantial wear mark where the tsuba would be on the nakago, so it was apparently worn for a while at this length. I can't tell whether or not the hamon continues into the nakago because of its narrowness near the hamachi and the corrosion. If it's suriage it's very neat, graceful work, the nakago is very nicely formed. This blade has, I think, seen some polishes in its life, plus unfortunately some abuse and sandpaper more recently. Corrosion on the nakago is thicker toward the lower part. The strange red spots just behind the machi appear to be remnants of lacquer. Any assessments, speculation, or guesses are greatly appreciated.

My Masatsugu gunto arrived today - I got it from a fellow NMB member to whom I am most grateful. The leather clad saya came with a matching tsuka cover. I very much doubted that the sarute was original to the koshirae, but now that I see it with my own eyes, I am beginning to have second thoughts.

No on the ura side. The star is never on the date side.

No shinsa in the EU, just US and Japan. You could take it to an NBTHK-EB meeting which are usually held every 2 months in various cities around Germany. The one in Solingen is probably the most convenient for you.

more

Here's what I have:

Noshu Seki ju Kojima Katsumasa saku https://www.google.c...1034&bih=790&dpr=2.5

Franco So, are you going to be referring to my verbal explanation or your eyes ?? Come on - the images are very clear. It of course has yubashiri but much more than yubashiri - as I said, it has the traits of hitatsura. The thick streaks you see are pure ara nie in the jigane and layered so thick that it is difficult to comprehend. The quenching temperature must have been rather high and he must have kept it there longer than usual. The nagasa is in the photo. However, to make all this more educational and easy, in my original post above I added an approximate translation of the museum plaque.

I believe this is: 備州長定 - Bishu Nagasada

Just in case @Jacques D. missed the red circles…..enlarged for his benefit.

Start with the above date "Ryakuo 4" (alternative reading Rekio 4) and work from there.

Where do you see shintetsu ? I think you need dot learn hada. Last words about Rai hada, you can see chikei in this area can you see chikei in shintetsu ?

Thanks again everyone. I gonna make a new topic is section "translation assistance" to figure out the kanji on the nagako as starting point.

Dear Mick. I'm slipping, here's the sword from the Festing collection. Not Tadayoshi at all. Description: 'A Shinshinto Bizen Yokoyama Katana by Sukenaga, dated 1850. The blade of deep koshizori, shinogi-zukuri with chu-kissaki, gunomr-midare hamon of nioi and ko-nie with yakidashi, midare-komi boshi, ko-itame-hada, ubu-nakago with kiri-yasuri, mei Kiku-mon Ichi, Biyo Osafune Kyo, Yokoyama Kage (no) Suke Fujiwara Sukenaga, dated Kaei 3rd year (1850), 8th month; length 70.5cm, curve 2.4cms, in army mounts, inscribed MAde by John Latham F.S.A. Sword Cutler. Maj-General F.W.Festing, June, 1950, with a chrome and leather scabbard.' All the best.

Nice to have an original copy though MIck Ian Brooks

To decide if this is a SURIAGE 'victim', one would have to see the blade from close, I think. Looking at the course of the SHINOGI, I am not so sure. Perhaps original and inspired by a Chinese lance?

It is a sword made by the South Manchuria Railway Company (SMR) and is better known by the name Mantetsu. If possible, take a picture of the markings on the nakago mune (this is the blunt edge of the tang). Below is a link to a brief article about them. Mantetsu - South Manchurian Railway

There are two kanji on the mune machi, but I am unable to read them: To go back to the sarute, although it doesn't look Japanese to me, I must say that, judging from its patina, it could have been on there for the last eighty years or so. The blade itself is in need of a polish: I think someone must have tried to sharpen it as if it were a bucher's knife and I see no hada at all, not to mention the hamon, which seems to have been obscured by the sharpening work. That said, I find this blade quite appealing: it feels really heavy in hand and quite sturdy as well. So now I am contemplating having it repolished, although I know it will cost me an arm and a leg and more than double the overall cost of this gunto. The tsuka cover is now back on.

Hi Martin, you probably know of this. While researching for something else I came across a reference to the collection of " The Archduke Franz Ferdinand of Austria" It mentioned that 17 tsuba with a link to him were to be auctioned off on Monday 10th December 1923 in the Kielmannseggsaale. This would seem to suggest that the nobility had the interest, resources and opportunity to acquire some good pieces. Source. Japanese Sword Guards In The Collection Of Georg Oeder Of Dusseldorf.

The original usually around 50USD if you look around a bit - seeing it's so old there's no longer copyright on it, so a new reprint copy can be had for half that price from various websites.

And from the British Museum’s Netsuké (although the one on the left may be a Chinese medicine doctor’s help).

Ishihara Yoshisada. If you search here in the group you will find a number of posts on Yoshisada.

Amazing how much can be depicted with just a few strokes of a chisel. You can see why the truly talented guys are so highly regarded.

While there is no record on why the umegane were removed, I was able to narrow down the time frame between 1907 (when the fotos WITH them were taken for the Bulletin) and a record shot taken in 1922 where there were already gone. The museum had several Japanese consultants coming over once in a while around that time period, so I can guess it was maybe done on their recommendation. But, its a mystery...

Steve, imo this is a fairly modern (20thC) item made for the tourist market. Probably Japanese rather than Chinese like most of the “copies” are

Very true. Took 8 months before I found my first blade. My second blade which I found a couple of weeks ago in Japan, is Yamato Senjuin per recent NBTHK papers, (although it has had a long time attribution as a Soshuden masterwork and was part of the Sozan Tsukamoto museum collection as such). Tanobe is writing the Sayagaki so I'm curious what attribution he gives, as its not classic Chu Senjuin. Possibly Ko Senjuin given the hada, hataraki and sugata. The blade, registered in 1966, has an interesting history which appealed to my collecting sensibilities. I tell myself my 3rd blade will be purchased in Japan next year when I attend the DTI. Patience is a worthy trait when it comes to collecting Nihonto.

I drop the two images of a fantastic habaki over from https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/49606-collecting-tsuba-seems-addictive-how-many-do-you-have-on-how-many-years/page/2/#comments Dated 8/20/2024 [or as we non Americans would write 20/8/2024] The habaki is a part of koshirae which comes with two opinions: 1. By "all-American old school shinsa of tsuba and tosogu": in suite mainline Goto, too unusual to be more specific, custom order. 2. By an "honorary Russian shinsa of crafts and blades": a combinations of pieces, all by different Goto makers. Only one piece he identified as early mainline Goto, the rest in his opinion are three (!) different generations of lesser skill.

Did a fast scroll through all the pages to see if this one had been posted, and it refreshed my awe at the amazing skill these craftsmen/artists have! Truly awesome talent. This has some really great deal work, on a sword for sale by @obiwanknabbe HERE.

We've seen one of these already, but a nice example of the bamboo wall, found on this Buyee/Yahoo Auction

Let’s do the reveal! As I said earlier, please cut me some slack – its easy to act as sensei when one runs the kantei and has all the cards, but still explanations should be given – and they should come with an exclamation its just a personal opinion. There are a few ways to judge this blade. Sugata locks you into either Kamakura-earliest Nambokucho or very late Nambokucho-early Muromachi. In hand the lack of niku and the balance point suggests Kamakura, but this is subjective. Its heavily nie-based so its either Yamato or Soshu, with some exceptions. The coarse jigane in shinogi-ji comes up as very long lines, and that’s a sign there is long masame there as well. Lets go Yamato route, its easier and faster. Possibility 1: Not much comparable in early Muromachi, so accept the notion its Kamakura. Kamakura Yamato by definition should be first and foremost considered as Senjuin. Possibility 2: Its Yamato with midareba. By definition it can only be Senjuin. That’s actually what the sayagaki argues. It can be added that nioi choji-like midare in Yamato is also exclusive Senjuin traits. Lets go Soshu route, its also fun. It does look like Satsuma, but nioi-guchi is seldom Satsuma’s strong point, it tends not to do nioi based midareba covered by nie and sugata is quite off. But its an important note, because Satsuma was particularly inspired by Go and Norishige. In the same way if we would say its Horikawa, we mean it looks like Sadamune. We can also right away check that nie 1cm wide and 20cm long endulating “belt” is either Yamato Shizu or Etchu, its Extremely uncommon everywhere else. So in Soshu route there are not that many practicing first class tight itame (often referred to as Awataguchi hada) with bright broad nioi-guchi and nioi/ko-nie hamon covered by nie towards habuchi. Most Kamakura lineage is strictly nie based, for example. The three options here are Sa, Naotsuna and Go. Some Mino Kanenobu are nioi based but nioi-guchi is weak and jigane is large featured. Naotsuna tends to have large featured jigane, more mokume. Sa is a good option, I felt. His itame hada is excellent, but he did not do much masame-nagare and ara nie away from hamon is uncommon. If you look at his kinsuji you don’t really see transition to masame. In fact, Awataguchi hada with nagare, bright broad nioi-guchi and nioi/ko-nie hamon covered by nie towards habuchi, plenty of ara nie and occasional use of “nie belts” in Etchu fashion is a textbook definition of Go. You can find the exact wording more or less in “Connoseurs”. Re: Nabeshima Go meito and many other examples. So what’s wrong with calling it a Go? First the boshi is not typical for Soshu, Go’s in particular tends to be much wider, its can be called “yakitsume” but its wide. Sugata is a bit different, the sori is larger, the tapering is larger than what you usually see with Go. There is arguably stronger presence of masame-nagare, nie within the hamon forms really nice clouds, but overall its presence is more… sort of “stout”. It has substantially more Yamato character to it. Here one can remember that there Senjuin Yoshihiro smiths from Echizen province, with signed examples, and Go Yoshihiro is often considered to be one of them. So the commentary of Honami Koson (which might be my confirmation bias, I really need to study the issue much more!) was that its Kamakura period’s Senjuin Yoshihiro, possibly the father of Go. This in turn should bring us to the question – what is the so called Senjuin school? As I mentioned, its not advised to be placed in judged competition except Ryumon Nobuyoshi. The attribution to particular names is impossible; there have been attempts to write up different subschools but they all run into problems that there are plenty of nijimei examples which are papered Senjuin but which are not consistent namewise with “Shigehiro school” etc. Its also largely attributed in a negative fashion: really old blade with Yamato features which is not Yasutsuna or Kyushu-mono. How did we come to this? To an extent we have to thank the “five Yamato traditions” for that. When the classification was created Tegai Kanenaga and Hosho smiths were considered almost mid-Kamakura, and Taima was also referenced in Kamakura genealogies. When it became apparent that Taima, Shikkake and Hosho were very short lived, Tegai did not really begin until 1300 – still the “five traditions” were kept. So you have a bizarre case that Yamato Shizu is not considered a mainline, while Taima does. Even more bizarre case is that while every Soshu tradition is “shadowed” by its Yamato counterpart, all of these counterparts actually can be found in Kamakura period’s Senjuin examples. Here is mid Kamakura “proto-Taima” in tight itame with nie splashed all over. The quality varies, but towards 1270-1310 you start seeing extremely high end Senjuin. Awataguchi hada, nie laced throughout; the best ones do tend to come to old attributions to Echizen Masters like Go and Norishige. But they are different: the forging style can vary a lot within the blade, more comfortable with pure masame sections, more comfortable with chouji midareba or nioi ko chouji based hamon. The signatures are sadly lacking, but it can be ascertained as Echizen Senjuin – a precursor to Echizen Soshu.