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My two tsuba masks

Even if is Japan, tell them you are sending it back. Undisclosed flaws is the worst trick.

OK, this is not meant as a criticism, so if Ian is out there reading this, I did enjoy your talk! Perhaps the word 'bloopers' was way too strong, but here are some things I noticed during the video, having watched it twice. 1. Portuguese with guns landed on Tanegashima Island in 1542 or (1543) depending on who is talking, not in 1534. 2. Tanegashima carries a strong accent in Japanese on GA, (not on 'shi') somewhat like Tane' /GA'shima, but perhaps in the West the accent is different. 3. The matchlock did not stay 'stagnant or stable' during the Edo period as massive improvements and refinements were made in their strength and weight, etc., but all within the matchlock remit. By Western standards, yes, there was no automatic evolution to other locks, this is true. Although flintlocks and wheel-locks did make occasional appearances, they were not encouraged for a number of reasons. 4. The various-sized holes in the serpentine (not all had holes) could have been used for a pin to hold the match, but generally they weren't, and as you say, loading would have been extremely dangerous with a fixed match there. 5. The longer 'wall' guns were fired from castle wall loopholes, but the fat hand-cannons of up to 30 kg were fired by hand, or rested on bales or mounds of earth on the battlefield. 6. The stocks were not made in 2 sections. There was a slit most of the way below the ramrod on many but not all guns, but above the ramrod the wood was solid. It was a kind of flexible figure of 8, the upper section gripping the barrel and the lower section gripping the ramrod. 7. From what I understand re the barrels, they were first a single sheet wrapped around a steel rod, then the kazura makibari spiral helix was performed over that. (see Sawada's book for illustration.) A double helix was better, as you say, and three twists were considered the best. (More than two were generally alluded to by the smiths as So-makibari or 'complete' helix work. 8. You mention not being able to see any writing on the gun, but there is an imprint seal of the lockmaker on the brass lockplate. The barrels were signed underneath, but you would need to remove the barrel to see if it is signed there with a place and name, and a date if you are extra lucky. 9. You mentioned they were made until the end of the 1800s, but this is true only for very rare commemorative examples. They were completely obsolete by 1870, having been superseded by foreign imports (and native versions) with improved loading and firing mechanisms and rifling during a process from about 1840 to 1860, i.e. mid-century. 10. Sugawa's book has been a stop-gap lifesaver for people in the West, but for multiple reasons it needs really serious editing.

No mask on this one, but I am told that these are items for Noh plays.

Choji oil is really just mineral oil with a bit of clove scent added to it. Tsubaki oil is camilla oil. A good quality mineral oil such as what you can buy at just about any pharmacy will work too. There is nothing that you can do yourself about the rust. That is something that this group strongly advises is done by a fully qualified sword polisher. A sword care kit will have uchiko powder in it. This really wont do anything to remove active rust, and can damage the sword further. It is strongly recommended that its use be avoided.

Noh mask ans music instruments..... in line withe Dale's tanto tsuba

Hey guys, A recent acquisition to collection and I felt it deserved to be shared. It's a Tokubetsu Kaga koshirae, original to the sword, resided in the private collection of an armor collector in Japan for over 50 years. Sword it was made for is a Naokatsu, made in Echigo. I would appreciate it if you could share additional information, as I have only just started studying it yesterday. Thanks

I will say, that most if not all people here are pretty opposed to any attempts at restoration of any traditionally made Japanese sword. Even those that are rusted. There might be a very rare exception on a blade that is actually worthless (multiple fatal flaws, retempered, broken/damaged beyond repair, etc.) that may not draw the ire of the membership here, but there are too many examples of some guy trying to polish up the sword his grandpa brought back from WW2 only to ruin a 200+ year old of beautiful history in their attempts. It's happened a few times already in the very short time I've been here and on the FB nihonto groups I'm in. If you look at a polisher's page like David Hofhine, you'll see VERY rusty blades brought back to an incredible blade. So many swords are not "too far gone" like many amateurs may believe. Remember that becoming a properly trained polisher (Togishi) is a +/- 7 year commitment under the apprenticeship of a master. It's as fine of an art in many respects as the actual forging of nihonto.

Compared to the huge knowledge base of Japanese swords, little is known about gunsmiths, and smith name lists are very rare. As to 'conversions', Roman, most appraisers and dealers are not aware of the very slight difference. There were two types of these, and at the new Nagoya 'Touken World' you can see a rack of each. The first are originally matchlocks, and there is a long shallow cutout in the right rim of the stock for the pan and lid. Conversions usually have the remnants of this long cutout, which is no longer necessary. Has yours had a later plug of wood fitted in there? Then there is the type that is to all intents using a tradionally-made matchlock stock and barrel, by the same smiths, except made solely for a percussion lock system. The cutout there is only large enough to take the nipple surround. Your pictures are rather dark, but from what I can see the latter looks the more likely candidate. It's a small difference, I agree. In my experience there are matchlock purists, who attempt to reduce a percussion gun's working parts back into a matchlock, so to such people this difference would be meaningful. History buffs might also enjoy seeing the evidence of overlap, two phases of Japanese gun history. In general though, it's horses for courses.

I also use these acrylic display stands (can be found in mineral shops for items like agate disks etc.).

I use these plastic stands I get inexpensively from a site called ‘WISH’. Items are direct from China in most cases. They come in different sizes, but I find the 5cm tall ones work best for almost all tsuba. No problem with scratching on iron tsuba, but if there is a concern I suppose the edges could be sanded down a bit or a small piece of cloth/silk could be used to cushion tsuba. They only cost about 50 cents a piece depending on quantity purchased. Other nice features are: they are stackable (don’t take up much room), because they are clear they don’t take away from or block viewing the tsuba, and if they get broken or lost it’s not a huge financial loss.

Osuriage mumei katana, 66.5cm nagasa with copper habaki and saya only. Gunome hamon in nie-deki with a thick habuchi. Deep sori, extended kissaki and raised shinogi. Futatsuji-hi on one side and the reverse with bo-hi and soe-hi. $700 + shipping & PP

Well, one of my best attached. I almost was foolish enough to sell this one during a dry financial period.

Dear @Barrie B, The masks on your sword are Okame (also called Otafuku/Ofuku/Uzume) and Hyottoko (“fire man”). They are usually considered a pair (and have been for hundreds of years). Some traditions call them husband and wife. Together they symbolize good luck and jolliness. Okame is also known as the Moon Goddess who played a very important role in getting the Sun Goddess (Amaterasu) to come out of her cave and give light to the World (part of the legends of the founding of Japan). She did a bawdy dance dropping her clothes and making all the other gods laugh, so Amaterasu (the Sun Goddess) came out of her cave to see what was happening. Believe it or not, Okame was originally considered the epitome of Japanese beauty (evidentially Dale @Spartancrest doesn’t care for the ancient beauty standards in Japan… personally I'm with Dale...) Today they are very common masks that are used in lots of festivals in Japan. As I’ve said before, while this is a wakazashi, it is not necessarily a “merchant sword” (working hard to get rid of that old and misinformed stereotype…) Okame derived from Noh plays which were written by and performed for the aristocracy (Samurai, NOT merchants). While she has evolved into a more common figure, Okame’s origins were in the Bushi class. Grev @kissakai, yours is fascinating because it shows a man stuck between the two, diametrically opposed versions of a woman. Your menuki are Okame and Hannya. Okame is considered the perfect Wife (ever cheerful and supportive) whereas Hannya (on the opposite side) is considered the ultimate jealous woman. In one of the Okame legends, she was supposedly based on a real Wife who gave her own life in support of her husband. Hannya on the other hand became so jealous that she was transformed into a horned devil with a serpent’s body that became so hot that she burned her lover to death in jealousy. Your sword must have been designed by Freud, because your kashira is Hyottoko (the Husband) caught between these two extremes!

Thank you guys for accepting me as a new member. I’ve read many bits and pieces from you guys board via general searches. Seems like a great group with a plethora of knowledge.

Just for us non-armour guys. The first post started off wondering if it's indeed all repro, then the thread continued as though that was answered. I didn't see anyone confirming that everything there is clearly post 1900. I assume so, but have we clearly identified that all parts are modern? Also, I think that there are quite a few who know the in's and out's of restoration, but just like swords, I expect everyone is hesitant to give advice in case it encourages novices to work on genuine armour, which risks damaging it much more. I suppose giving tutorials on how to do it would lead to many thinking they can haul out their old pieces and "give it a go" I assume it's like telling someone how to play with patination on their old tsuba.So I can understand the lack of "how to" answers.

Wow...stunning koshirae, and textbook Kaga. Lovely!

As far as I know, saku and kore are interchangeable largely. Don't think that would be considered a mistake. You get saku, kore, kore kitau etc. It's still complete as to meaning. Was just going to post that link that Bruce did. You can also visit http://meiboku.info/mei/zodiac/index.htm

The holes could be filled easily with leather repair filler, they do many various colours in many shades. You would hardly see them, used it a few times. The question is whether you should?, Don't see it as much of an issue either way.

Hi mate, message coming your way about this sword. Mark Australia

Followup: I found this article from the British museum useful because it lists their techniques for doing some cleaning as well as maintaining lacquers and some fabrics. Didn't answer all my questions such as how to stabilize rust or spot-clean silk but it's a start for others who may be in my position. https://www.britishm...-suit-samurai-armour

Me like http://world.seiyudo...m/product/ka-121222/

Oops, Alex, missed this. For some reason Tanegashima updates do not appear among the new posts every day. I'll go back and make a list of bloopers when I get a minute. Overall though, it is nice to see something like this.

I browse that site pretty often. They are definitely using a low contrast, diffused lighting setup but they do that for every blade so I think it's just a chosen method/preference as opposed to trying to be deceitful. Some blades it probably does a disservice to actually. If I had to guess they're reducing the clarity and texture filters as well in Photoshop to give it that soft look. It makes it pretty hard to judge the blades, at least for a newbie like me. Below are examples of some sites that I think have high quality photography. https://swordsofjapan.com/ https://www.owazamono.com/fine-swords https://eirakudo.shop/ http://world.seiyudo.../?orderby=price-desc

Usually NBTHK will only give what they are comfortable with. If they only thought Mishina, they would have stated only that. In this case, they are probably stating “one of the Kanemichi smiths” but no hint as to which one. If they wanted to be more specific, they would have stated the generation or given a time period. With mumei blades, this is usually pretty good. What can be a little more frustrating is when there is a mei but they don’t help with the date or generation.

The clear stands are optimal for sure. A while back you could get a transparent white filament for printing, but it wasn't transparent at all once printed. I'd love to have a perspex plate (with a small peg) so that the whole face of the Tsuba is unobstructed, and, if a mirror behind, the whole face of the reverse side would be unobstructed too. I have looked for something proprietary that would meet this want, but it seems there is nothing readily available, and id have to construct them myself, one by one.

Victor: Here is the term for this type of flaw. Note that it is a fatal flaw, meaning the blade cannot be relied upon to function properly. John C.

@thutson - I was looking through this thread today and looks like we have a very similar mask design:

What happens sometimes with nihonto is that the ha/cutting edge gets chipped. When the blade is then polished the ha gets raised up to the level of the deepest chip [in order to remove that chip]. In the areas where the hamon is shallow there is the distinct possibility that the hamon becomes interrupted, a fatal flaw. There is some indication that this may be the case here. Regards

Sorry Bruce I just had the chance to remove and have a close look at the habaki. These are just gold inlays(decorative) I was hoping to find that it was holding a split or something

Im not really concerned about resale value with this project. A beautiful Koshirae is something I really enjoy looking at. Id probably be able to find an antique Koshirae at some point with enough time and searching, but If im going to admire a Koshirae on display in my home I don't want it to be for a sword I don't have. To me it just feels too incomplete.

I think so. Run away.

笹葉 抱茗荷透 – Open work of bamboo leaves and daki myoga FYI: 【つば屋】　武州伊藤派・笹葉/抱き茗荷透かし鐔・透鐔　　　検索：（赤坂/尾張/長州）の落札情報詳細 - ヤフオク落札価格検索 オークフリー (aucfree.com)

Evening Cicada / Higurashi 蜩

Something that may be informative on the subject is Tamio Tsuchiko's book The New Generation of Japanese Swordsmiths. In particular there's a chapter on Ohno Yoshimitsu, and the focus is on a shift in thinking and considerations he goes through in order to support sword orders for marital arts usage, which is not the same as his typical orders to forge swords for collector appreciation. This is one of the best living Japanese swordsmiths, who produces swords either for appreciation or for practical use.

Thank you Brian I believe you summarised the situation very well. I have enjoyed listening to those who have focused on the top end either as students or collectors their enthusiasm and knowledge inspires people like me to work harder to understand the subject. I have also enjoyed the enthusiasm and commitment from those who for whatever reason could never reach the hallowed turf of High-Art swords and they outnumber those who can by a very very long way. Whether art or not some of these works have survived hundreds of years and have passed through many hands that have valued them for whatever reason. If someone is happy to continue that then they deserve respect not condemnation.

We shouldn't celebrate mediocrity, perceived or real, but we shouldn't disparage those buying the best they can find within their means.

Thanks gents. Will add some information i forgot and some photos, did my best and as usual just took them in sunlight. Forgot to mention this sword was made with a Bizen influence. Its large and heavy, further measurements as follows. Not bang on accurate but close enough as used a tape measure. One thing i like about modern Shinsakuto. Your owning the sword the way it was made, without it having seen many polishes etc that effect appearance. Width at Habaki 35mm Width at Yokote 21.5mm Kasane (thickness of blade) at habaki, 8mm Plus donation to NMB upkeep if sold.

Piers, thank you very much for your extensive answer. I assumed they used patches, now I know for sure. This technique may have been discovered independently in many places. Perhaps it was even brought by the Portuguese, who probably knew it. I was fascinated by this phrase: 'manuscript of around 1600 showing inventive use of doubling or cutting or linking lead ball' Wars seem to inspire human invention tremendously. Its fruit is a flood of inventions, although most of them impractical or useless. This has always interested me. Are there any sources of information, usable by a “gaijin” (paper or electronic), on these early gunnery oddities?

Ah yes this also has an Okina (old man) mask theme. I believe it is one of the oldest of the Noh repertoire and represents an older male with long white beard expressing wisdom and bringing longevity to families. The rounded eyebrows and the separated lower jaw makes it different from the other masks, the chin is attached to the main mask by a cord (which you can see nicely in the attached picture). Okina masks have an abstract pattern of the deeply carved wrinkles around the forehead and cheeks and the formation of the eyes is in open slits, rather than sculpted eyeballs with a hole for the pupil. I'm also enjoying and learning a lot from this thread, thanks for everyone who has shared something! Tom

That's a lovely tsuba Barry! I have a Okina mask themed tsuba and a very nice Hannya mask tsuba. Regards, Tom

Here is a tsuba with a mask theme.

These are my masks - Sorry don't know anything about them apart from what they are These are rushed images and the colour is way of for the first image

Hi Dale, LOL.. My interest is because I own this handsome 'Merchant' Koshirae (for lack of a better description) that has similar themed Menuki.. Bit of an unusual theme for a Samurai, I would have thought..? I think it was made very late Edo, when merchants and artists had money? Perhaps I should research the Kozuka artist to put an approximate date to the Kozuka, to support this theory.. I assume it was made for, and owned by a Kabuki artist..? Any other theories? Barrie.

Nobuie. Steel. 8.2 cm. Yattsu Mokko-gata. The thickness of the tsuba swells considerably from the nakago-ana (4 mm) to the mimi (6 mm), creating an "expansive" effect to the motif, which I believe to be a stylized lotus blossom. Tsuchime-finished surface. The signature is of the type that is referred to as "Futoji-mei," attributed by most scholars to Nidai Nobuie. I do not know if the plugs are solid gold or another material with a gold sheeting applied. Momoyama Period.

About Yamakichibei, here is mine

You guys have some beautiful stuff. It is also great to be able to see the contrast between the "in your face mind-blowing" kinko stuff and the subdued great iron more "plain" works. Keep them coming. Brian