Two Russo-Japanese War era Swords

[Wolfmanreid]

I recently was given two swords that I believe are a Type 25 cavalry saber and a civilian officials sword from the late 19th or early 20th century. I plan to sell them but does anyone have a good idea of value?

 

Thanks!  Reid A.  

 

 

[Bruce Pennington]

Reid,

 

To be fair on value we’ll need to know and see a little more. The left one is a Type 32, but is a bit unusual as the palm of the grip isn’t crosshatched. Could be a repair piece. These tend to run in the $400 range.

 

The shorter one appears to have a real fighting blade in it. Price could hinge on knowing who made it. We’d need to see pictures of the nakago (tang).

[zook]

Hi Reid - are there serial numbers on the cavalry saber/scabbard ?   thanks, Dan 

[Wolfmanreid]

Thanks to all who gave these a look. Here are some more photos. To my surprise the scabbard and blade match on the cavalry saber.

 

[lonely panet]

Reid,

 

To be fair on value we’ll need to know and see a little more. The left one is a Type 32, but is a bit unusual as the palm of the grip isn’t crosshatched. Could be a repair piece. These tend to run in the $400 range.

 

The shorter one appears to have a real fighting blade in it. Price could hinge on knowing who made it. We’d need to see pictures of the nakago (tang).

 

Bruce, its not a repair, the hatching has simply been worn away from either long term ware or over cleaning. 

 

serial numbers on type 32/1899 troopers swords are very misleading as they over lap in areas and then there a re-issued swords.

if you want a date check the front of the D-guard, you will find something there. its going to be pre 1920s as its still got the finger loop stud with was later abandoned due to poor performance 

 

the second sword is a molested piece, most likely a early naval patrolsmans sword or a "(policemans sword) ". if you show the back straps engraving I can provide conformation.

I say molested as the habaki has seen soldered to the D-guard. so the possiblitiy of the blade not being correct,  or its been put to togeather.

 

with early police swords the koiguchi can be a stylized cherry blossom finished on the edge.

[zook]

Hi Guys - 

Good points by hamfish .... I have a type 32 in much nicer condition with matching serial numbers on sword, scabbard …. dated 1913, Tokyo arsenal.  I think I paid 300.00 for it about 2 years ago.  I think 400 is a bit high unless prices have gone up considerably in the type 32s, and I admit I haven't been following them closely.. not recently.  -  Just a data point.   I believe I saw one on ebay with matching numbers for 375.00 ….  as Hamfish stated, lots of re-issues on the type 32s, so I don't think the serial numbers mean as much, but nice to have.   Dan 

[Wolfmanreid]

Am I correct that the cherry blossom/Sakura badge on the back strap of the “police” sword is indicative of a military sword? Might this have belonged to an MP or civilian policeman working with the military in some fashion?

[Kiipu]

The short sword has the plum blossom which is associated with China and Manchukuo.

[Austus]

Fantastic photos.  Next best thing to being there.

[PNSSHOGUN]

The police sword appears to have an old blade, it's not unusual to see the Nakago or tang reshaped to fit the handle style on early swords. Resale value will be limited as there is quite significant rust damage to both swords and the condition overall isn't spectacular. I'd just hang onto the police saber, it's a real Japanese sword and may continue to intrigue you over the years more than the couple of hundred dollars you would get for it now.

[Shamsy]

The lack of emblem on the backplate of the handle shows it's not a police sword. Or should I say, the backplate isn't. Someone should check Dawson's.

[Bruce Pennington]

Wolf,

Your specualaion is spot-on. Dawson shows the emblem as the Manchuoko Navy patrol. The style handle is of a shore patrolman. Dawson's similar blade design has a Japanese patrolman emblem, but on the next page, he shows your emblem on a Manchuoko naval officer sword:

[Wolfmanreid]

Thanks for all the replies. I took the blade out of the civilian fittings and spent about an hour rubbing it with a cotton rag and a little clove oil. It doesn’t appear to be in nearly as rough shape as I’d initially assessed. I’ll post some photos just of this blade on the nihonto section tomorrow.

[lonely panet]

ahhh the photos,  yep the plum blossum seals the deal. manchuko naval partrolmans sword  is a mouth full. 

 

shame someone dicked about with it, i wouls say this type of sword wouls be limited 

[stackinnutts]

Anyone have thoughts on this sword? Quite large- early nationalist period(?). 

 

https://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/146827176_large-antique-chinese-nationalist-republican-sword

 

https://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/146827176_large-antique-chinese-nationalist-republican-sword