1966 Saga article on Japanese sword

[Peter Bleed]

Dear Friends,

 

I fear that this effort may get complex, but...

for good reason I today scanned and made dense pdf's of an obscure 1966 article on "Japanese treasure swords" that was published in SAGA a real pulp men's magazine.

I find this article interesting for a couple of reasons. It is a rarity. It documents the (sorry) state of knowledge that was available to the first generation of post-War collectors, and it has some stuff on lost National Treasures. The data presented here has been made completely obsolete by information presented on this forum, but I think it might be of historical interest to sword otoku.

 

The following dropbox has some 8 pdf's. That means they require something like adobe to view. And they are a bit slow so you have to be patient

 

The file 'Complete Portfolio.pdf' (101.5 MB) is available for download at

 

< http://dropbox.unl.edu/uploads/20120927 ... tfolio.pdf >

 

for the next 14 days.

It will be removed after Thursday, September 27, 2012.

 

I hope this works and that it is of some interest.

 

Peter

[k morita]

Mr.Bleed,

Thank you very much!

I have wanted to see this report of the magazine.

 

3),5),,13) were already discovered.

----------------------------------------

1) Katana: Masamune(Meibutsu,Honjo Masamune),Tokugawa family

2) Tachi: Rai Kuniyuki (Yamashiro), Motoda family

3) Tachi: (Aoe) Masatsune (Bicchu),Kumano Hayatama shrine

4) Torikubi-Tachi(Ken),Kumano-Hayatama shrine

5) Torikubi-Tachi: mumei, Niu shrine

6) Tachi: Rai Kunimitsu (Yamashiro), Matsubara shrine

7) Wakizashi: Kunihiro (Shoshu),Matsubara shrine

8 ) Tachi:Iyeske (Bizen),Tamashima shrine

9) Itomaki Tachi:Nagamitsu (Bizen),Aso shrine

10) Tanto blade with Peony designed gold scabbard and handle,Aso shrine

11) Archaic Tachi style with round handle,Kamishima shrine

12) Katana: Norishige (Ecchu),Kagoshima shrine

13) Katana: Akihiro(Shoshu),Kagoshima shrine

14) Katana: Shume no Kami Ippei Yasuyo (Satsuma),Miyasaka shrine

--------------------

[Peter Bleed]

Morita-san

Thank you for the positive response. I was glad to know that the link I sent is working. The positive efforts of Bumpei Usui and Albert Yamanaka deserve our respect, even if this old article is flawed. The "information" and values presented in the article help to understand the activities of the sword enthusiasts who built collections and supported mass return of swords to Japan in the 1980s and 90s.

And thank you for posting the Masamune oshigata. Can you tell me where that image is held? Is it in the NBTHK?

Peter

[Brian]

Anyone interested in the docs above, should be sure to download the ones by Stephen Thorpe uploaded to the NMB called "NT and IAO list and sword documents by US Gov 1945-1950" and found in our archives section. Many of the National Treasure swords are mentioned in both docs and there is a lot of info given on the missing swords.

Surprising that the one tanto's whereabouts were known, but the seller was asking too much for it. Wonder if it was ever tracked down and returned?

 

Brian

[Peter Bleed]

Brian,

Indeed, I should have drawn attention to Mr. Thorpe's wonderful discoveries and additions to our understanding of the "lost" National treasures. I have looked for but never found the list of missing treasures presented in the Yamanaka Newsletter. Is it there somewhere? If it is, he certainly didn't highlight it. It makes one wonder what Albert was doing with the information.

Finally, I am too interested in the historical trivia, but the Saga article made me wonder if the JSSUS Newsletter would sell better if we allowed advertisements for "Wonder Slim Belly Flatteners."

Peter

[k morita]

Hi, :D

The line drawing of Honjo Masamune is an old rolled book which I possess.

 

Just two years ago, I visited Washington D.C from Japan, and visited to The Library of Congress with Mr.Stephen Thorpe.

We perused many rolls of line drawings of swords in a reading room. :D

(I saw another line drawing of Honjo Masamune in there.)

 

I think that 30 or more long rolls(line drawings of Japanese swords) exist in The Library of Congress.

A thesis will be able to be written if someone studies these rolls. Someone should challenge it.

[bentheproducer]

Dear Morita,

 

I am currently helping to produce a history documentary about the Honjo Masamune for the UKTV HIstory Channel. In the course of my research I have been in touch with Peter Bleed who has been hugely helpful in both research and providing material for the film. One image which we would really love to use in the film is the line drawing of the Honjo which you mentioned in this thread. As such I wondered whether it might be possible for you to contact me directly via the following e-mail to discuss any re-production possibilities?

 

E. ben@worldmediarights.com

 

As is always the case in TV, we are faced with very tight deadlines so your prompt response would be hugely appreciated.

 

Thanks so much.

[k morita]

Hi,

email sent.

 

Did you read the following description?

http://www.nihontomessageboard.com/honjo.html

 

Another line drawing which appears on [Tsuguhira oshigata](Published in 1928) as a line drawing of Honjo Masamune sword is known.

[k morita]

This photo is The Library of Congress's long roll of line drawings of Honjoj Masamune.(lower sword).

Arm is Mr.Stephen Thorpe . :D

[Brian]

Interesting to compare 2 of the oshigata Morita san has provided us. The similarities are clear, and in my mind this must be the real deal.

I think we have just about most of the important info on the Honjo Masamune here on this forum. A search will pull up multiple threads about it, with even more info.

To Ben..good luck with the project. I am sure all of us would love to know more, and view it when it is released. I only hope you will have nothing to do with "Steve" or "Zack Crebber" or "Lucien Berry" who still believe he/they know who owns it and values it at billions...and claims it is buried.

 

There are bizarre discussions around this sword online, both here and places like: http://forums.samurai-archives.com/viewtopic.php?t=553

 

Brian

[Baka Gaijin]

Brian,

 

Please move my comments to Izakaya if you feel them inappropriate here.

 

A Sword (the Emperor's or the Shogun's) was made from a meteorite by Masamune and given to his Daughter's boyfriend who was Spanish with a Scots accent and immortal then many years later it was taken to America and stolen by a secret brotherhood of Ninja and Yakuza who then argued over who should have it and one of the Yakuza cut his finger off to show his loyalty to someone there was a huge fight then Delta force recovered it (the sword not the finger) led by Chuck Norris who took it back to the Shaolin Temple because of something that happened in 'Nam where someone with a Mullet said something profound about Boosheedo and in there somewhere there was a Blonde who I think was a friend of the Director anyway she had a line and a cheeky smile to camera and there were definitely some Mexicans doing a deal with the Triads who wanted it because the Xin Emperor's elixir was involved and Scott Glenn got buried up to his neck in a Garden and Toshiro Mifune decides to track across the Wild West where at breakneck speed a car executes a 180 and exits out of frame and an ochre coloured Dust cloud settles to reveal Uma Thurman and Sonny Chiba.......

 

I could go on but that would spoil the ending for those who haven't seen at least one of the seven or so movies with a stolen sword as plotline.....

 

Hollywood has been living off this for years.

 

Cheers

[k morita]

Hi,

Missing the national treasure sword which the Tokugawa family possessed is a historical fact.

There are no photograph or no reliable Oshigata of Honjo Masamune sword in Japan.Therefore, I am impressed by the uncertain line drawing.

 

Brian,

Thank you for the comparison of two line drawings.

 

No reply from him yet.

[k morita]

Mr.Bleed,

 

Mr. Thorpe uploaded this paper at following past thread on NMB.

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=12074&p=103925#p103925

 

Since the paper is in early stages of investigation by the Ministry of Education of the lost swords, it is not perfect.

[k morita]

No replies of e-mail from 'bentheproducer'.

Probably, his posting was a joke. :lol:

[Brian]

No so sure. His email goes back to http://www.worldmediarights.com/

About World Media Rights

World Media Rights is currently one of the largest factual programme producers in the UK. It has 945 completed programmes in its catalogue. In about a month 433 hours of programming will be available for downloading straight to your computer (or hard disc) to own from this site.

WMR was created in 2006. After four years of acquisition it now supplies factual series to forty countries around the world and its programmes are regularly seen on AETN and Discovery (in the USA and the UK), France 5 and Planete (in France) and ZDF and Spiegel TV (in Germany). Its programmes are also regularly shown on television networks in the Middle East, Asia and Australia and New Zealand.

Brian

[Wah]

Friends,

I hadn't intended to say anything, but...

Glad to see someone is enjoying the materials I brought back from National Archives. I had everyone on this forum in mind when I got these so please enjoy.

To date, the oshigata that Morita san and I viewed in Library of Congress of Honjo Masamune that shows my arm, is the most precise oshigata of the hamon I have seen. If it is a real oshigata of the blade, then the blade was too short for today’s katana standards….

 

Morita san, how are you? Is it possible that you got my PM on the other oshigata of Honjo by Kotoku?

By the shape of nakago jiri, maybe the Honjo was made by someone else. Hahaha! Then again….

 

If this Ben fellow does finish his documentary/drama , I sooooo look forward to seeing if they will get sgt. Coldy Bimore’s name right. :D

Cheers, Stephen T.

[Peter Bleed]

Stephen,

I am very glad that you have joined this discussion. I also hope that you realize that I posted the Saga scans simply because I had them and thought that they might be of historical interest. Your discoveries are important. The Saga piece is curious.

Some on this list may recall that I wrote a bit of a story about lost treasures. Since I had no idea who Coldy might have been (if he existed at all), I made the made up a GI named Hervey Stimpson.

I sincerely hope that you will draw your work together in a publication. Lots of us will want to read it.

Peter

[k morita]

Stephen,

 

PM sent.

Two years ago,we viewed many long scrolles of line drawing of swords in The Library of Congress.

I got a long scroll of line drawing of swords(not Oshigata),after returning from WashingtonD.C.

(Honjo Masamune is not drawn in this long scroll.)

[mdiddy]

Stephen T,

 

Thanks very much for sharing the documents about NT's and IAO's from the Library of Congress. They are a fascinating set of documents. Besides the story on the Honjo Masamune, I was maybe more surprised by some of the holdings of leading Japanese families that were mentioned, particularly those of the heir to the Mitsubishi trust. I wonder where their 2 purported Amakuni ended up.

 

Matt

[Wah]

Stephen,

I am very glad that you have joined this discussion. I also hope that you realize that I posted the Saga scans simply because I had them and thought that they might be of historical interest. Your discoveries are important. The Saga piece is curious.

Some on this list may recall that I wrote a bit of a story about lost treasures. Since I had no idea who Coldy might have been (if he existed at all), I made the made up a GI named Hervey Stimpson.

I sincerely hope that you will draw your work together in a publication. Lots of us will want to read it.

Peter

Peter,

 

You sent me the Saga article a few years ago and I thank you for them. There were some things in it that were very helpful and I have really enjoyed reading it.

I have not read your book yet and I am sorry if I said the wrong thing. It was not my intention to point my statement at your book.

 

Morita, I sent you a letter. Thank You!!

 

Matt,

Stephen T,

 

Thanks very much for sharing the documents about NT's and IAO's from the Library of Congress. They are a fascinating set of documents. Besides the story on the Honjo Masamune, I was maybe more surprised by some of the holdings of leading Japanese families that were mentioned, particularly those of the heir to the Mitsubishi trust. I wonder where their 2 purported Amakuni ended up.

 

Matt

Matt, It is my pleasure to share with the forum who has helped me through the years.

Stephen T

[Wah]

Hello again,

I was looking back at the documents I brought back from National Archives and found some more that may be of intrest that are not found in the pdf I originally gave to nihonto message board. I will put them up as I find the time.

 

Here are two documents that were one paper originally. I suppose this was the paper issued to the Japanese peoples by the Education Ministry to certify their blade was art object quality.

 

Stephen T.

[k morita]

Hi,

I bought this book. :D

Many Japanese proper nouns appear.

[Wah]

Morita san,

How are you? Have you finished this book yet? What did you think? I bought the book off Amazon and read it a few weeks ago. Stephen T

[Brian]

One I have been meaning to pick up sometime too. Since Prof. Bleed is on board, I wonder if he has a batch of these to sell to forum members or do we have to purchase them elsewhere?

 

Brian

[John A Stuart]

Yes; and signed too. That's always nice. John